Determinism of Free Will :
Idrees: AoA sir g
Vooler: I’m not here right now
After few minutes Vooler again joins Sir Idrees and says sallam
Idrees: Wa alikum us sallam
Where were you before?
Vooler (smiling): nothing but here
Idrees: Where are you busy now a day?
Vooler: I’m working for my web developing and busy to complete it.
Idrees: Hmmm ok
Vooler: I have done 80% work of my site
Idrees: At present we are also busy in our site problem. American Company has blocked our sites and now these are running by Blue host.
Vooler: It’s good news.
Idrees: Our sites have missed 30000 visitors but case is still there. We shall go to even court because our main source of earning is in danger.
Vooler: Of course, you shouldn’t give it up at any cost.
Idrees: We have changed the ownership of our sites
Vooler: Yeah, you told me and new owner is Jasim’s address. Right??
Idrees: Yeah, absolutely right.
Vooler: Don’t worry sir; we have to face these problems in life.
Idrees: Agree with you, everyone has to face them in life. These problems are part of life. This is the world of ……………….in Meer taqi Meer’s view.
Vooler: You are right sir but we can’t close our eyes from the real fact. We need to face them instead of disheart. We should slap them back.
Idrees: SPACE FOR POETRY
Vooler: Man is free about his choice and can think about his good or bad. So you can’t blame God for what you can’t win or lose.
Idrees: This is an illusion of man that he has freedom of choice it’s technically impossible.
Vooler: You gave me brief detail on this so that I could believe.
Idrees: I can prove it and make u answerless with only two or three sentences. Let accept my challenge right now.
Vooler: First of all kindly read it what I am writing, then you may proceed.
Idrees: Ok you can write, I am watching the screen.
Vooler: GOD knows from start to end – which species is going to act according to his will and which not, and he was so sure about having this crucial time on earth, and also he is very well aware of our next act as per our unique DNA composition (in each person), so, finally, he knows and he already knew Who is going to be What. But yet I deny this without any argument because he is superior of all and can change what has been decided for you (as per your acts) as apparently he has given you a brain.
That’s it > now you go ahead sir.
Idrees: Ok
Let me go ahead. You are absolutely right.
As per your acts he can change the thing which is in his knowledge that what’s going to be happened. According to your point of view, every specie or living organism have their own free will. Am I right sir?
Vooler: right.
Idrees: Let me explain you with an example. Take an example of bee that flies from one place to another.
Vooler: Sorry to interrupt you but they don’t do it at their own will. They have intellectual ability like human being and Jinn.
Idrees: I said I am going to explain it for you, please wait.
The bee who flies God knows where he will go and on which branch he will sit on
Similarly a deer who decides not to move towards the danger using their thought. When they do so they change there mind from one point to the other because of the situation they are facing.
Now I come to your saying that living organism has their thinking approaches. Human being can change his mind. I mean as you said that God knows the next moments because He is superior and He can change his will on the spot as per our acts.
Vooler: exactly
Idrees: Great
I call this freedom of will “Illusion of Will” and not the actual illusion
Of course this illusion persists. Every species have their own thinking ability and they can manage their thoughts according to the situation. Every kind of species has such free will.
Vooler: “which is predefined”?
Idrees: Let me now give u two or three major reasons as I said above. God knows all about what is happening around. He is all knowing. ALLAH is Khabeer. Do you know Khabeer?? One who has the knowledge of everything.
So either we do it by our own wish or with deterministic approach God must knows Aleem is Aleem.
He who has all the knowledge.
Vooler: Just a minute sir
Idrees: Yes, you may take your time.
Vooler: Anybody that commits wrong is decided and what his obvious will is just illusion he is bound to?
Idrees: right
Vooler: Ok agree somehow but….
Idrees: See if u don’t agree then we’ll have to make amendments in God’s view.
Vooler: Why has he created heaven and hell, for purifying the invalid ones, that means he is doing an experiment only?
Idrees: Do you know the heaven and hell is here on earth. It is Islamic view and not some sort of western fiction.
Vooler: Having complete knowledge of right and wrong and even locations mentioned that jinn had approach to (we are denying all I am sorry).
Vooler: Sir Quran tells us when jinn accepted Islam after completion of Quran.
Idrees: Quran never said such thing as we are told about Jinn theory
Jinn are powerful but not intellectual or wise or even have sha’oor also Malaika.
Vooler: But it is in Quran that they used to fly near heavens to collect imminent activities
Idrees: Both of them don’t have wisdom it’s only human thing
No no no this is not Quran specifically which you are quoting now.
Vooler: jinn has freedom of choice sir that’s why they accepted Islam (a group)
Let me give you reference if you allow me to?
I have proof
Idrees: it’s in Hadith as an explanation of the Ayah “Rujoomul lishayaateena”
I am giving you the same Ayah
Vooler: Give me a second
Idrees: which are you going to give me?
Vooler: I think it is within Aal-e-Imran give me few minutes
Idrees: ok write the Ayah.
Vooler: I cant find it but as far I remember it says ” a group of jinn came to Muhammad (SAW), and said the book which has just be revealed is truth and we used to hear from heavens and fly till the limitations, and how we find a comment chasing us when we do so and no one can hide from Allah by just flying, we accept Islam”
It is not exact but I promise to bring it to you
It is not Hadith. It was Quran I read.
Idrees: But for now listen to me. There are Quranic terms and used many times with different situations for example
What is Ghulam (slave) in Quran?
There is not a single word for Ghulam in Quran which describes Ghulam as we know
Everywhere it’s been used for the son
“Bighulaamin haleem”
Ismail the son of Abraham is called Ghulam in Quran and so forth for the son of Yaqoob and others. So anywhere in Quran if some concept about slavery has come it’s in other terms such as
“Ao Ma malakat Aimaanukum
Wo jo tumhari milkiyat main day diyay gaey”
So it’s not Ghulam I mean it’s not the slave.
Vooler: But what I am talking about is so much clear and can’t have second meaning.
Idrees: And Ghulam is only Son according to Quran e Pak.It has been used but not in the meaning as we take. Jinn are not such creature as we are told. Although it’s Powerful but not intelligent. Let me show you a grain.
Vooler: ok
Idrees: a tiny grain has 70,000 Malaaika in it
Why? What does this mean by Quran or Hadith or where this thing comes?
A grain has the power in it. It can break the soil and thrust out from the soil, from where we can’t even dig without any iron weapon. The grain comes out rapidly because it has 70,000 Malaika means the invisible powers of God either they are Malaika or Jinn.
Vooler: Qul auz be rab -in naas, says Jin very clearly as an intelligent entity
Idrees: Now please listen to me for one minute more
Vooler: Not as much as human but ok
Idrees: Yes that’s is the thing I am going to clear
A’araabi this is Jinn on some places as I explained also the force that disturbs your stomach when you increase your calories. Jinn are made up of fire as many other living organisms. Human runs by fire as an engine of car which keeps up living because of every stroke.
So sadder? What is sadder? This includes chest only not heart or any other organ.
Vooler: We are away from actual topic, it is absolutely the same problem as my dad has he takes too deep that actual topic is lost, you are just like my dad right now: D
Idrees: I am talking about “fee sudoorinnas” as you mentioned above right now
How Jin enters in our sudoors? I am talking about Jinn. I am telling u the meanings of Jinn according to Quran. There are three meanings
Aaraabi
1. Aaraabi
2. Hararay
3. Bacteria
Three of them are invisible and powerful
What is Aarabi? A villager (dehaati) who is invisible for the culture and tradition. This man is not much mentioned but only on one or two place. One of them is
Ya ma’sharal Jinn e wal ins
Aiy jinno aur insaano kay muashray
Tell me where the society of Jin is? Did u ever thought about?
Vooler: They used to live before us.
Idrees: Anyway, next context clears that they were aaraabis
Vooler: And they are forced to leave territories occupied by man
Idrees: Yes. The Neanderthal
The cromegnaans.
Vooler: it works now
Idrees: the astrilo pethicus the Homo sapiens all of them were Jinn. They used to live before us and they were made by only fire. Because they never stayed on land, Land mean soil. We are made by soil. What does this mean? It means that the tribes who lived were made by soil. They had the same habits according to their soils.e.g. A man of hills, a man of desert, a man of planes. All of them are mentioned in Quran Teen, salsaal, kalfakkhaar lazib and more. This is all about the creation of those stayed tribes of early humans who stayed near wherever in Iran and India. At first they stayed on land then they became humans and they got their thought. So we are made by soil means that we stayed on land and the others???? They were Gypsies and they were Rakhshash according to Hindu Myths and Rakhshas is also Jinn. They were made of fire only fire because they didn’t have the other thing the civilization which was caused by living on land permanently and they had only the one thing
The metabolism=ana bolism + cata bolism
It means the factory of fire so they were Jinn and they used to live before us. According to Iranian the Adam’s name was Kumrous and according to Hindus the Adam’s name was Brahma but this Brahma was in actual Ibrahim and Braham putters were the sons of Ibrahim.
Vooler: sir I think you have changed meanings of jinn. Do you have a book on this?
Idrees: You are not following the logic Ali and the Quran e Pak. There are three meanings
Neanderthals were jinn, they used to live on earth and they made wars and murders
But humans needed to live on land so they were bounded to be peaceful that’s it.
Vooler: And Neanderthals that you just said were also early form of humans?
Idrees: Yes they were found and according to fossils clock they are almost 82 thousands years old
Some of them but they were more than that old process.
If u like just Google the Neanderthals
If you want some meaning like supernatural thing type thing of Jinn. With due apology I would like to say that you will be desperate at the end. Because there are no such supernatural thing as jinn only human is super natural (found) yet and God (not found) yet. But there are other ways to approach the God immaterial ways.
Vooler: And I need to bring you what I read and then we can continue talk from there, because frankly (and respectfully) I disagree some of theories I need strong evidence for.
Idrees: I will give u strong proofs never mind. You won’t deny the agreement. You should watch some videos of you tube. I will give u sometime and I think they will sufficiently satisfy you. I didn’t get any thing from YouTube. I wrote everything in my books before I came on Internet. So don’t think that i am inspired by some science fiction.
Vooler: Thanks a lot sir. I’ll wait to watch your suggested videos and articles. It is nice to discuss with you on such interesting topic. Moreover we shall talk about this topic next time till then ALLAH HAFIZ.
Idrees: You are always welcomed, and ALLAH HAFIZ.
